Map Replay Limit

General Comments, Questions about all things OmnipotentS that don't go in other topics/forums
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pooty
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Map Replay Limit

Post by pooty »

Previously the map rotation limit was 21, and I moved it to 12 after some in game feedback, that people wanted to play certain maps but couldn't vote for them with the large rotation limit. I think it was FuriousRabbit, and he wanted to play MinusBadger (which is an awful map with no Avrils)....

However it got me thinking, especially with some matches being shorter, might be worth thinking of making it even lower say 3 or 4. The risk is you get stuck playing Desert JY, AJY, Minus, Minus, DJY, AJY, Minus. However if that makes the vote then there you have it democracy in action...

Thoughts?
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YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH
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Re: Map Replay Limit

Post by YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH »

Only out of morbid curiosity I'd be interested in trying a low number like that. Maybe even no cooldown. See how people vote. I don't know, maybe it'd work out? It is kind of a bummer when all the favorite maps are greyed out because someone played them three hours ago.
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infinitecat
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Re: Map Replay Limit

Post by infinitecat »

The question is: Why are some maps more popular than others?

I know it's not easy to alter maps but it's certainly possible to improve the appeal of even the least-played of them.

Perhaps Omni's players can be asked to consider one map (at a time) and offer ways to improve it.

At the very least, those whose suggestions were used would be likely to champion these new maps.
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Tater
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Re: Map Replay Limit

Post by Tater »

I'm down to try anything...
That being said I think it'll just be influenced by the MTMU junkies in an infinite loop for all eternity.

I also think it'd be easier to vote less played maps if the vote menu wasn't cluttered up by maps we never play. I know we can search by name but I can rarely remember the name of a map once a match is over.

Also also, I still think we should have a special admin force vote once every night or two... would help force some players to adapt to maps so we could play them more often (suspense, downtown, dryice?, fullnecropolis, nivavalley, whatever is a fun map that's been tweaked enough to be playable).
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McLovin
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Re: Map Replay Limit

Post by McLovin »

Tater wrote: Thu Nov 04, 2021 1:06 am ...force some players to adapt to maps so we could play them more often ...
Haha! Nice theory, but you can't force anybody to adapt. All that happens is people leave and you end up just 2 or 3 players left. Seen it many times, even this week.
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pooty
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Re: Map Replay Limit

Post by pooty »

A couple of "observations":
- Many of the players (and some degree of correlation with forum participation), don't seem to be interested in learning a new map. They want to get in a tank/mino/levi, sit in one spot and do the same thing over and over again. Its almost like its overwhelming, and maybe when several of our clever players figure out a good spot it demoralizes them. Think about it, if you were relatively new to Minus and someone gets into the Dognuts spot with the Mino, you'd be like damn, I can't do shit on this map. I for one, like figuring out new strategies vs. just wash/rinse/repeat. I'd rather lose badly trying something new than say sitting in the Missile Tank on DJY kicking the other team's butt.

- We have a whole subforum for Map Improvements. I've been taking "Less popular maps" and looking at them to tweak them (or ditch them -- Trench anyone?). I've updated several eg. Silva (Tall Trees map, we've played maybe 3 times), Hustle comes to mind, but this suffers from 1. Players either don't know it 2. Know and don't like it. 3. Don't want anything new. It'd be nice to get more feedback on the forum (I do usually "take notes" during play if I can especially on any of my edits) - on what's wanted. I generally do requests -- Updated Dreamus is on the server for example.

- I am down with removing some of the maps, I've put some oldies back on (TwoFences, Acerbus etc.) that really need updating -- or maybe removed. I agree too the list is too long. I'd love to remove Minus-Kamek -- I'd rather play Nightwolf with the nexis. Maybe I'll create a google doc and we can "vote" on keep/remove them on the list... and get an idea of which maps are universally hated -- the played metric on the server isn't good since several popular ones get "fixed"/adjusted, especially as vehicles change (eg. Nevermore classic, gunshop etc.)

- Sometimes new maps, despite my efforts still kind of suck. Part of this is play testing it tough, even with bots. It takes at least 3-4 matches to get decent feedback, and usually 2-4 rounds of editing. its hard to anticipate what human players will do, especially guys like Enyo, Tater, Leon, and sneaky ones like Terminator, Roger. I think there's a learning curve --
who knows where EMP and LInkNukes are on Halloween? SSR on Dreamus?
Jumpads to roof/tower on Suspense?
Where nukes are on newer maps?
Good spots for power vehicles like Mino/MAS?
How to use the vehicles properly (last night saw someone in Omega charging in vs. standing off an ioning the nodes)

That being said, I think maybe going down to say 5-7 (usually number of maps played during peak evenings). Maybe 6? This would likely avoid playing the same map in the same night.
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McLovin
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Re: Map Replay Limit

Post by McLovin »

pooty wrote: Thu Nov 04, 2021 9:35 am ...
I'd love to remove Minus-Kamek -- I'd rather play Nightwolf with the nexis.
...
Sometimes I just wanna play a nice plain-Jane Minus-Kamek without all the new bells-and-whistles. I'd request keeping both around.
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pooty
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Re: Map Replay Limit

Post by pooty »

My problem with Kamek is once you're beaten back to your primaries... its really hard to comeback...opposing team just spams base with two ions, mino and you can't even get out of the base (they two HHeads are easy pickings. I suppose Nightwolf has the same issue plus Nexis.
I'd love to figure out a small tweak to get the beaten team a chance to comeback -- maybe add a turtle or something to provide some core protecting from two spamming ions.
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Enyo
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Re: Map Replay Limit

Post by Enyo »

pooty wrote: Thu Nov 04, 2021 9:35 am I'd rather lose badly trying something new than say sitting in the Missile Tank on DJY kicking the other team's butt.
Amen! I'm a bit ADD, so I gotta keep moving, and it's one reason I like flyers so much. I get bored out of my mind after sitting in the same spot more than 30 seconds. Bu, simple minds are easily entertained, so guys like Ecmerd do the same shit over and over.
pooty wrote: Thu Nov 04, 2021 9:35 am That being said, I think maybe going down to say 5-7 (usually number of maps played during peak evenings). Maybe 6? This would likely avoid playing the same map in the same night.
With 3 or 4 version of MTMU and D-junk and a couple Nevermore's, I fear that's all we'll every play, save for the occasional MasterBath. I mean, I never really have an issue not getting to play a map I like on any given night, and I think there's about as many of us that like new maps as the ones that want rinse and repeat.

I think 5-7 is way too low, but try it and see... as long as you promise to increase it back the first night we play nothing but MTMU, Djunk and NM. FuriousRabbit is the only one I've heard of complaining about the map voting cool off, and man I think that guy really is pissed off.
“Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.”
― Mark Twain
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Enyo
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Re: Map Replay Limit

Post by Enyo »

And if we ever want to be able to play any of the Badger maps with a busy server, including the all Mega one, then McLovin seriously needs to stop fucking around on those maps at 5 in the afternoon every day. He's the main reason they're never available to play when the server's actually busy.
“Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.”
― Mark Twain
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