Vehicles in play/maps

Discuss and provide feedback on Maps.
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YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH »

Did the MoBreaker primary fire sound ever get fixed? For me it's still silent. Pooty if you want another file I can get you one. With the link nuke we found I needed to bounce him one of a lower sound quality (2004 tech). Can anyone else hear the primary fire?
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by Enyo »

YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH wrote: Thu Sep 09, 2021 3:25 pm Did the MoBreaker primary fire sound ever get fixed? For me it's still silent. Pooty if you want another file I can get you one. With the link nuke we found I needed to bounce him one of a lower sound quality (2004 tech). Can anyone else hear the primary fire?
I hear the mobreaker primary fire. However, the 2nd seat with missile fire is broken and needs fixing... take one hit from anything while in the 2nd seat and it will knock you out AND kill you, leaving your mobreaker empty for the other team to steal. pooty, we talked about this last night, maybe it's a good project for snarf to work on? He seems very adept at fixing vehicle issues.
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by pooty »

The turret thing I think its fixed. I tested it with bots..they blasted me with Ion Tank and I lived while in the turret. The updated Mobreaker.u file is on the server, as of literally 2 minutes ago. Its Mobreaker 1.1
I know the updated version is on MassD V15 and Minus-RandomizerKitchenSink. Some of the randomizers might have the old version embedded.

As far as the sound its there, and there might be some older ones. But if you want to update the sound to 8-bit, mono I can update it..but right now it works but doesn't sound great...I hear it close up, but not far away.
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by pooty »

Ok, WRT to all the fliers.
I think we need to make a "max speed" and "max manuverability" limit. I think the Falcon 3.0 is about the fastest/most manuverable combo we should get. The Starbolt is faster straight line, but not manuverable and fragile. So fast, clumsy and fragile ok. Slow, manuverable and tough.. also probably ok (like Helix).

But for the other fliers, Predator/Reaper and the G-Police Venom and Havoc they are just too hard to hit, very fast, hard to hit with shock and they generally out run Avrils and Batteries. Even things like Hurricane/mino/centaur turrets have a hard time hitting those. It might be that they have too small hitboxes, but I think its more the speed...especially moving in a circle they just sit up high, with no fear of shock or avrils....and its no fun unless you have an equivalent flier.. I really think its the speed and the engine can't keep up...making it hard to hit because it can't render it all properly in time.

So as we work through the vehicles..especially the fliers they need to have balance..

There's just not enough balance on them..so I'll call this the to be fixed list:
Predator this is work in progress
Reaper this is work in progress
Gpolice Venom MKII - these I think are only on Dria and KitchenSink
Gpolice Havoc these I think are only on Dria and KitchenSink
And they are messed up on Dria..I had a self healing 800pt Venom..yikes.. (of course I still died in 2 second from leon).
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Enyo
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by Enyo »

After playing DryIce with all those new super fast flyers on it, I have to agree Pooty. It may all be a bit too much, especially when you're in the mino and the Reaper can just spam you with exploding rockets making it impossible to see anything, much less be able to hit the damn thing with lasers. Some of these new flyers, especially the helicopters, are breaking gameplay dynamics and I think are turning a lot of players off.

You were there last night when we played Dria Randomizer and there was a lot of grumbling about the OP and hard to hit nature of the newer flyers. Then, after the first couple rounds there was a mass exodus of players. In about 30 seconds we went from about 12 players on each team down to 4.

I think we need to be careful in adding too many new toys too fast. While many of us like new things and feel like it keeps things fresh, it's obviously turning some players off. I saw an old post somewhere recently, I think in a referenced post from the old forum, where Carpe and someone else were stating how sad they were that ONS no longer resembled the game they use to love. And that was well before we ever took it over.

As much as I enjoy some of the new flyers, I even feel like some of this new stuff is starting to feel like shades of the RMD server where they got super carried away in creating new extremely OP weapons and vehicles all the time for their own enjoyment of working on such things, but it was to the detriment of the server as a whole and people quit playing there. The RMD server owner is a huge dick too though, as in extremely ban-trigger happy, so that surely had something to do with its demise to. Just a word of caution.

Maybe instead of adding a bunch of new OP vehicles, we should shift focus to just fixing the vehicles that have been here a while but still have issues, like snarf did for the badgers. The Hurricane's hit box is still jacked up where tank shells go right through it from the side. And the whole rolling camera thing when the mino or levi get hit with bio goo. Those seem like long overlooked issues that maybe our new "vehicle specialist" can figure out.
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by McLovin »

What was the RMD server, never heard of that one. I really only know of the CEONSS and DeathWarrant servers.
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH »

Enyo wrote: Fri Sep 10, 2021 9:33 am
Maybe instead of adding a bunch of new OP vehicles, we should shift focus to just fixing the vehicles that have been here a while but still have issues, like snarf did for the badgers. The Hurricane's hit box is still jacked up where tank shells go right through it from the side. And the whole rolling camera thing when the mino or levi get hit with bio goo. Those seem like long overlooked issues that maybe our new "vehicle specialist" can figure out.
Agreed. I'm for most of the edits done so far, but for some reason every time I get smoked by a helicopter from above it's pretty annoying. Yeah perhaps the people who aren't on the forums feel the same way but might be more inclined to just stop playing rather than speak up about it.

McLovin, I think the server's still active. Check it out. It's an incredibly modded/OP version of onslaught. It's way over the top if you ask me.
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by pooty »

Yes, that was the point of my post. Most of the newer flyers are only on Randomizers with a couple of exceptions DryIce, DeseretedSands and MassD.

Part of the idea was to "try them" on the Randomizers and see how they worked. I think we're close to getting some of them playable (like Predator/Reaper, Starbolt (even though its fast and hard to hit..its hittable I took it out several times with Mantis, and even shock, as its health is low..I have a new version that isn't quite so collision fragile though), retuning the Ifrit and Omega, both of which IMO are hittable. Both are pretty powerful, but not in the sit and spam kind of way.

I agree we don't need to make this like RMD, which is why I brought up the point on the flyers..Its ok if we have a few, but like the OmniHelix, which is pretty good from up high, its easy to hit and flies like a mino.

Right now, the focus isn't on adding any newer vehicles, although Snarf added Pallas and Spank Badger, both of which I don't think really break the game. The focus is cleaning up the other ones. I need to clean up the Starbolt, Ifrit, Omega. Badger fix is going on the server at some point this weekend (although I have to work Tonight and Saturday night -- so I might wait until Sunday). Funny though no one complains about an overpowered ground vehicle..in fact, much complaining about the "Classic" Mino vs the Omnitaur.

From there I want to fine tune a few maps-- Update Randomizer and remove some of the problems, especially on Dria-Randomizer, AJY-Rando, KitchenSink. Among the others...DryIce (which I feel is finally decently playable, just needs a few tweaks), my longer term OperaHouse some tanks/foot map, maybe with the Lightweight Copters from TDWarfare (which are Underpowered), and few other edits of existing maps (Silva, Acerbus, DowntownXL are few that come to mind).
he Hurricane's hit box is still jacked up where tank shells go right through it from the side. And the whole rolling camera thing when the mino or levi get hit with bio goo. Those seem like long overlooked issues that maybe our new "vehicle specialist" can figure out.
These would be good.

The other thing mentioned was getting the vehicles consistent...like Alt-fire for zoom on Twin Beams..(Alligator, HellHound, Ballista etc), as well as consistency in other vehicles.
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by pooty »

So perhaps the more immediate fix is to edit the "problematic" vehicles out, which I could probably do tomorrow at somepoint. And then work on updating the VehicleLoadOut map with the updated versions, even with the Problematic ones for test purposes.. I am sure it will get played as seemingly the chaos is fun.
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Re: Vehicles in play/maps

Post by captainsnarf »

Enyo wrote: Fri Sep 10, 2021 9:33 am After playing DryIce with all those new super fast flyers on it, I have to agree Pooty. It may all be a bit too much, especially when you're in the mino and the Reaper can just spam you with exploding rockets making it impossible to see anything, much less be able to hit the damn thing with lasers. Some of these new flyers, especially the helicopters, are breaking gameplay dynamics and I think are turning a lot of players off.

You were there last night when we played Dria Randomizer and there was a lot of grumbling about the OP and hard to hit nature of the newer flyers. Then, after the first couple rounds there was a mass exodus of players. In about 30 seconds we went from about 12 players on each team down to 4.

I think we need to be careful in adding too many new toys too fast. While many of us like new things and feel like it keeps things fresh, it's obviously turning some players off. I saw an old post somewhere recently, I think in a referenced post from the old forum, where Carpe and someone else were stating how sad they were that ONS no longer resembled the game they use to love. And that was well before we ever took it over.

As much as I enjoy some of the new flyers, I even feel like some of this new stuff is starting to feel like shades of the RMD server where they got super carried away in creating new extremely OP weapons and vehicles all the time for their own enjoyment of working on such things, but it was to the detriment of the server as a whole and people quit playing there. The RMD server owner is a huge dick too though, as in extremely ban-trigger happy, so that surely had something to do with its demise to. Just a word of caution.

Maybe instead of adding a bunch of new OP vehicles, we should shift focus to just fixing the vehicles that have been here a while but still have issues, like snarf did for the badgers. The Hurricane's hit box is still jacked up where tank shells go right through it from the side. And the whole rolling camera thing when the mino or levi get hit with bio goo. Those seem like long overlooked issues that maybe our new "vehicle specialist" can figure out.
All of the new toys definitely broke the balance. It's why I occasionally throw out a vote for vanilla Torlan. It does a lot of things right.

1. AVRiL is a separate pickup.
2. Sparse vehicles, makes turrets useful
3. vehicles have balance with strengths and weaknesses, pedestrian vs vehicle has a chance

It's also one of the reasons I think masterbath is one of the favorite maps. It's mostly stock UT.

It's funny hearing people complain about 'classic' minotaur being weak. We keep going bigger and bigger. Today most maps have AVRiL in weapon locker and shock, flak, rockets also. On old maps those things were special that you had to go get. Today WGS nuke is the special thing you go get. When I first modded the AirPower vehicles to fix dropship, I also nerfed predator and reaper pretty severely, but it was to bring them in line with existing flyers. Everybody complained lol. Things like battery launcher helps, but it also sucks that you need a specific weapon. AVRiLs were preferred but if you only had shock rifle you still had a chance. Not so much today vs mino, bio, or even badger. The player health/firepower is no longer in balance with the vehicles like it used to be.
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