A few maps to be pulled?

[Rhamp]

What’s funny is all the hitscan flyers like Starbolt and the bombers/Arbiter can all be taken out easily on foot. An LG shot and two shock rifle hits kill the Starbolt.

And Rhamp, I can’t tell you the number of times I’ve gone head to head against a Starbolt with a Falcon and won. And you strangely left the Dragon off the list of hitscan flyers, it’s hitscan, has bombs and tons of health. Sure it’s not fast, but it’s often one of the most powerful flyer on a map. And it one shots a Starbolt I think.

And dang, people say I have an ego, but you’re not quite as dominant in these flyers as you think you are. At least not when I’m around. And I get lasered/sniped plenty when I’m in these flyers.

If the falcon can get close enough to the starbot, it wins, but if the starbolt pilot knows what they are doing, they can just keep distance and laser the falcon to death. The dragon is more balanced since its slow as fuck and has the hitbox of a barn. The reason why most hitscan fliers are op is that they are fast, do high dps, and are good against everything, and the only counter is a better player or one with aim. There is no rock paper scissors here.

The point I was making about me wiping AJY in a flier isn't that I'm a good pilot, its that no vehicle should run a map. Idc who is in a vehicle, it should not be able to 1v10 period, that isn't fun for either party. Also when you are on the other team, I find it more useful to play defense and keep you from running the map so my team can play unmolested. I got bored whoring all the op fliers to duel all the time. Its the same reason why dm maps suck if all the dmers are on the same team. Cali or any other of them wiping the floor with no opposition isn't fun.

Sure fliers are weak to sr, which is why I bail out and start using it, since more than half the fliers are dead meat to hitscan fliers. There are very few players who can do this though, most don't have the aim for it and resort to avril spam, which can be baited into terrain, outran, or simplely shot down. I'd rather actually dogfight instead of having to resort to using the sr or sitting at the fog camping with hitscan.

[FuriousRabbit]

its that no vehicle should run a map. Idc who is in a vehicle, it should not be able to 1v10 period, that isn't fun for either party.

I disagree. I think it adds a lot of fun and dynamics to the maps. Frankly, I find most of your maps boring because of your philosophy. Everything is either overpowered or everything is mundane. All to suppress the impact of our learning-impaired brethren (aka "stains" on this forum). But it makes for very boring maps.

For intelligently designed maps, you don't need an OP vehicle to counter someone running the map. E.g., the best offense against a mino is a skateboard and goo; the best against mechs is a skateboard and LG. For a starbolt, almost any ground-based AA can take it out. If a team elects not to counter a vehicle running a map, well, that is one stupid way to lose, among many many others.

[pooty]

No vehicle should be able to run the map with ZERO counters. So Mino typically has goo (whether manta or board), flyers lasers/twin beams etc.

All the power vehicles should have A counter, not necessarily MANY counters. FR you are correct in that it should require strategic use of vehicles.

I contend that stains hurt the team the most because they tend to waste key/power vehicles. Say its a flyer map and the suicide the arbiter or starbolt -- your team might be in trouble.

I think we do want to avoid the situtation where there's no counter, say Mino, no bio, no goo and only goliaths and slow tanks. Although even that could be fun as you'd have to gang up, but generally there should be a weakness counter to a power vehicle -- and as stated if the stain parade ignores it (you know like not linking up on LinkerMadness maps).. then at least one team will have fun.

The key is respawn times and number of vehicles -- maps that constantly stalemate usually have too many or vehicles that respawn too quickly, so that even a full onslaught doesn't overwhelm the team.

[Rhamp]

For pulling maps, the regular versions of AJY and DJY should go.

When the randomizer versions are on cooldown, these still get voted and its still the minus/junk/dria bullshit. At least with the Dria and Minus variants, they differ enough to where they play differently, but the regular versions of the junkyards are just the same as their randomizer counterparts other than slightly different vehicles. Why have basically multiple copies of the same map?

Also if you want to talk about endless spamfests, the base versions are so hard for a team to gain an edge to actually win the map. Its an hour of slamming tanks into each other on mostly flat terrain.

[pooty]

Its an hour of slamming tanks into each other on mostly flat terrain.

Many of our players seem to enjoy that...

[YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH]

Oof I don’t think the originals should ever go!