Map with no vehicle respawns

[Rhamp]

I was thinking about making a map with a single center node and vehicles only spawn at the core, but each of the vehicles has an absurdly long respawn timer. The map would have a layout with a bunch of cover for tanks to take positions to try and zone out parts of the map. There will be only tanks, badgers, trucks and artillery of vairious sorts (no mino, levis or fliers). I'll add a teleporter from the core to somewhere near the center node so if your team has no vehicles in the core left, they can still get to the center node.

I've noticed complaints about too many op vehicles, so I want to make a map where the vehicle caliber is toned down, but have it still be an interesting experience. With vehicles not respawning, every vehicle kill counts, so those regular goliaths become much more valuable. It also shifts the skill level, favoring those with good positioning and driving instead of those who can grab a starbolt or odin and murder half the map. If there are more players than vehicles, then those extra players can be the repair crew, linking up damaged vehicles to keep them in the fight. This type of gameplay isn't really possible in any existing map, since you just grab another vehicle or wait for one to respawn.

Let me know what you guys think of this idea before I go invest a bunch of time into it. Maybe making the vehicles be randomized could spice things up too.

[pooty]

So take a look at the UltimateMappingToolsOmni.u package. It has the UltimateONS Factory. It has several options for vehicle spawns, you can make it spawn after a delay (Ion does this on airport), has sequential or random or probalistic (can assign probabilities vs random) vehicles spawns, different spawns for differen teams etc.

This is just a fixed version of https://wiki.beyondunreal.com/User:Crus ... ppingTools (it had a bug where it always spawned vehicles unlocked for the other team which I fixed in the Omni version).

So you could have center spawn every 45 spawn say truck or goliath, and core vehicles start with Scorp, Truck, Tank and then done. etc.

[captainsnarf]

It's a good idea. Most of the stock maps are like this.

It might not get played much, but don't let that hold you back. Most of our crowd seems to prefer vehicle deathmatch to actual teamwork. I made OldSkool-V2 due to complaints of there not being enough vehicles in V1, but I limited vehicles on purpose so players would have to cooperate. They hated it

I think more people like the OP vehicles than complain about them.

[pooty]

OldSkool-V2 due to complaints of there not being enough vehicles in V1, but I limited vehicles on purpose so players would have to cooperate. They hated it

I think the multi-dodge was the big reason it got so much hate, with players "flying" across the map, while the mortals had to walk/dodge jump.

I think its a good idea too. I've tried to focus new maps on less Vehicle DM (ForestJY aside), and more on teamwork, both Airport, and Maelstrom-Linker both need teamwork, and if your team is full of stains that don't work together, you'll lose fast.

[YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH]

I was thinking about making a map with a single center node and vehicles only spawn at the core, but each of the vehicles has an absurdly long respawn timer. The map would have a layout with a bunch of cover for tanks to take positions to try and zone out parts of the map. There will be only tanks, badgers, trucks and artillery of vairious sorts (no mino, levis or fliers). I'll add a teleporter from the core to somewhere near the center node so if your team has no vehicles in the core left, they can still get to the center node.

I've noticed complaints about too many op vehicles, so I want to make a map where the vehicle caliber is toned down, but have it still be an interesting experience. With vehicles not respawning, every vehicle kill counts, so those regular goliaths become much more valuable. It also shifts the skill level, favoring those with good positioning and driving instead of those who can grab a starbolt or odin and murder half the map. If there are more players than vehicles, then those extra players can be the repair crew, linking up damaged vehicles to keep them in the fight. This type of gameplay isn't really possible in any existing map, since you just grab another vehicle or wait for one to respawn.

Let me know what you guys think of this idea before I go invest a bunch of time into it. Maybe making the vehicles be randomized could spice things up too.

I think this is a good idea but it might flop. I've always been curious of maps that encourage realism like this. Other similar ideas that have popped in my head over the years:

1) "real" weapons/vehicles only. minigun, sniper, rockets, grenades, tanks, heliux
2) no nodes, cores open. must have people actively defending your base
3) no cores, only nodes. death tickets determine winner

Maybe that's just me wishing you could still play Battlefield 1942

[captainsnarf]

I think the multi-dodge was the big reason it got so much hate, with players "flying" across the map, while the mortals had to walk/dodge jump.

I count exactly three players. The hate had to be more than that. It's too 'DM' was the gist I got, not enough vehicles.

[Rhamp]

I have the map mostly done, but I'm running into issues with the ONSVehicleRandomizerOmni. When there are only two vehicles in the randomizer, it works correctly (I used heavy goliath with weight 0 and heavy link tank with weight 25; the core pair has a min and max weight of 50 and two heavy link tanks spawn at each core). Now when I try adding a bio tank with a weight of 20, the whole thing fubars and spawns whatever it feels like, ignoring the weight constraints. It still ensures both cores have the same types of vehicles, but I don't want the cores having the possibility of 10 bio tanks. I briefly glanced over the code and didn't immediately see anything that would cause this behavior.

[captainsnarf]

A 10 biotank randomizer would be fun. biotanks can't kill other biotanks lol.

[pooty]

ONSVehicleRandomizerOmni. When there are only two vehicles in the randomizer, it works correctly (I used heavy goliath with weight 0 and heavy link tank with weight 25; the core pair has a min and max weight of 50 and two heavy link tanks spawn at each core). Now when I try adding a bio tank with a weight of 20, the whole thing fubars and spawns whatever it feels like, ignoring the weight constraints. It still ensures both cores have the same types of vehicles, but I don't want the cores having the possibility of 10 bio tanks. I briefly glanced over the code and didn't immediately see anything that would cause this behavior.

Been a bit since I looked at that code. Are you using the points? I was unsure exactly how it used weights, most of the randomizer maps just balance by random picks in the point range. You could use the UlitmateONSFactories, but that won't guarantee each side gets same unless you use the sequential.

[Rhamp]

Looking at the code a bit deeper, the code is spaghetti when it comes to choosing vehicles. Now I understand why sometimes the junkyard maps have absolute op vehicles when they really shouldn't based on their point limit. So the ONSVehicleRandomizerOmni tries to choose a set of vehicles for each group of nodes at random, ensuring they follow uniqueness and isFlying constraints. Once that set of vehicles is chosen, it checks to see if the total points of the chosen vehicles fall within the min and max limit for that group. If it doesn't, then it tries again, up to 100 times, at if it still hasn't gotten a valid combination, it just leeroy jenkins with whatever the last set of vehicles is. When I was testing my map, the constraints are such that the probability of a randomly selected subset of vehicles being within the allocated limits for each node group is such that the randomizer would fail almost all the time. For now, I could just finish up the map and see how horribly unbalanced the randomizer makes it. At least it makes it so both sides have the same vehicles, so 10 bio tanks vs 10 bio tanks could be a thing.