Mass Destruction...

[FuriousRabbit]

I agree with pooty that a lot of the spammy maps get voted because we generally have mostly mid to low skill (or just plain lazy) players that feel like they can't compete unless they have a super-powered spam monster to drive around.

Maybe, but tactics and strategy are no longer sufficient. I can handle Dognuts in a mino (unless he has team backup). But I am completely outclassed by Anon and Snarf when the shock or LG Mechs are around. I have difficulty hitting them when they are in the Mechs (half the time I hold too still and then they just hop out and LG me in the head). By contrast, when I'm in the Mech, they give two LG shots to the head and I'm dead.

At one point this server was more about tactics and strategy. Now it feels more like either just plain chaos or twitch skills. And MD was a map that enticed some unique tactics (soon to be removed).

[pooty]

At one point this server was more about tactics and strategy. Now it feels more like either just plain chaos or twitch skills. And MD was a map that enticed some unique tactics (soon to be removed).

I haven't changed out MassD yet... I haven't reviewed the updated one and is it a replacement or and additional choice? idk.

I think most of the admins are in agreement (speak up otherwise) that we want more focus on tactics and strategy than choas/spam/OP stuff.


Even when I made MD, there was thought how do I counter a bunch of levis? EMP, big nuke, OMFG -- gave the guy on foot a chance to make a difference.

Are the mech much different than a mino? The big mino has huge AoE, so you don't even need to aim like a shock or LG mech...I will say though Mino is much easier to hit. I know snarf made some Mech hit box changes so maybe that helps.

[Rhamp]

I'm all for removing the newly added lightning mech to reduce the oneshot spam. I added it as more of a joke than anything since its on my rhampededition image. The goal for this edit was to reduce the spammy nature of the map and remove the need to have levis and other AoE spammers camping the nodes, which I find is boring and also seems to be what the admins are trying to remove. The added terrain makes it less of a spamfest and allows for more teamplay in coordinating tank pushes with the added classic minos.

The replacement of the boards was due to people like anonymous who were completely unkillable on them without AoE spam. With AoE spam being almost completely removed from the map, the boards would dominate. Either I'd have to remove the OMFG or other fun pickups or remove the boards. The noderunners are still fast and hard to hit, so its not like that playstyle would be removed.

The added odins and lightning mech is more for swatting fliers than anything else to put an emphasis on having a strong tank presence to counter them. This was to address the discussion of flyers being too op and tanks being too useless.

[FuriousRabbit]

Even when I made MD, there was thought how do I counter a bunch of levis? EMP, big nuke, OMFG -- gave the guy on foot a chance to make a difference.

Yes! It is exactly that kind of thinking which IMO differentiates between a good map and a great map (I'm not saying MD is a great map - too many OP vehicles - but it is pretty good at what it was designed to be and I'm not sure it can be "fixed"). An ability to strategically arrange counter measures is also what makes randomizer degrading, although I admit that it fits some maps well.

Are the mech much different than a mino? The big mino has huge AoE, so you don't even need to aim like a shock or LG mech...I will say though Mino is much easier to hit. I know snarf made some Mech hit box changes so maybe that helps.

I'd say yes. Using or killing the mino is accessible. The shock and LG Mechs have a number of prerequisites related to twitch reflexes including hardware (probably at least 144Hz monitor), setup optimization, and time spent training in DM. And that is both to use it and kill it. It baffles me that some here complain that a single person can ru(i)n a map with the mino when clearly the same thing can happen with those Mechs... which are even less accessible.

[FuriousRabbit]

The replacement of the boards was due to people like anonymous who were completely unkillable on them without AoE spam.

I always understood that to be the "contract" with the boards. You can get from A to B mostly unkillable, but you cannot attack vehicles, and when you exit you are on foot. Almost like a portal for foot soldiers. I wish Torlan linker had these so you could more effectively get behind and attack camping sniper vehicles.

[Enyo]

It baffles me that some here complain that a single person can ru(i)n a map with the mino when clearly the same thing can happen with those Mechs... which are even less accessible.

Careful Furious, you’re starting to sound like me.

[pooty]

And that is both to use it and kill it. It baffles me that some here complain that a single person can ru(i)n a map with the mino when clearly the same thing can happen with those Mechs... which are even less accessible.

I haven't played with the Mechs improved hit boxes. They go down pretty quick to LG, especially if two are shooting it. In fact, I think its *easier* to take down the mech than a mino if you're on foot. Nothing does hitscan 178 pts to a mino, whereas LG does that to Mech and a headshot does 5x (I think). The harder part is taking mechs with vehicles, I get lots of "unregs" there....

I wonder too is maybe mech should take more than 45 from shock rifle, maybe 60ish? You know its shocking its systems...

But back on topic for MassD, might be worth making a few changes.... if I finish the Hospitaler today, I'll poke at it. Might be more fun without Omnitaur, Megas, and replace those with Classic Minos. Some of the flyers need package updates anyway. And might adjust the vehicle mix...a bit too. Love to see more reapers (the invisible thing is useful). And I want to revist the node layout, I think getting rid of the simple 1/2 core would help.

[captainsnarf]

I probably won't play without the boards. And the trick to shooting someone on the board is you have to hit the board. The character when on the board has no hit box.

[pooty]

On my version the boards will always stay, they are good balancer and good for those that don't like to sit and spam.

[YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH]

How about just a mass D where there are no nodes? Cores are open like 2fast. You can either attack or defend.