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So for other multi-seat flyers:

Cicada - Stock OBP vehicle
Dragon V3.2 - this one is pretty good.
Wraith/Banshee - Wraith seems to play well. I have updated skins (red/blue) ready to go on the server soon. It will automatically update on some maps that use the PVWraith Package, embedded ones have to be changed. I think damage/flight charateristics are good.
Draco - Decent enough for what it is..close in support.
Mirage Vulture - from other thread -- needs main weapon nerfed a bit...does too much damage.. maybe reduce rate of fire.
RMD Warhawk (from Magic Isle) - this is basically a tougher Mirage Vulture -- I think we will just leave it. I am not sure we ever got permission to use it from RMD.
TugBug - Cicada like but second seat has tractor beam like the pulse traitor -- has some issues when running on a server (we don't use it on anything today)
FireBlade - Smaller scale, on Mega Minus, and AJYR - this seems to have a very small hit box (and it does flash with shock hit)...which should be expanded -- weapons aren't super powerful, but very hard to hit.
Helix/OmniHelix - This started as the Helix and I modified it to OmniHelix (updated Miniguns damage and Angles, added Chutes) -- probably good enough as is.

Oooooh! Maybe snarf can figure out a way to make the Wraith/Banshee 2nd seat alt fire tractor beam the alt fire for the pilot/1st seat like we've talked about before? Really sucks having to switch seats and be totally stationary while using tractor beam weapon.

I had started work on a Raptor type vehicle that did just that first seat link beam/heal like the wraith. I never got around to finishing it.
That being said, I think given that the beam from the wraith is often invisible (which I think is a bug BTW), balances out by you having to be in the 2nd seat and stationary--think Nevermore 5/6...its still pretty potent and provides a balance. I like the Wraith as is, the primary missles are pretty fun, and second seat is actually useful. We only have a few vehicles where second seats are useful (Mino, Hurricane, Wraith, Troop Carrier, Tiamat, Mobreaker (2nd seat are fast, accurate, high knockback Mercury missles), most are pretty weak.. and lots of our players would rather drive around in a badger than work as a team in a vehicle.

On a primary seat version I think we'd have to figure out how to balance it...maybe slower heal? It would also be cool, to have it start with say 250 health, but set Max higher, so you could "drain" it up to say 600...which shouldn't be too bad since it won't have any long range weapons..it has to get close.

pooty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 25, 2021 10:11 am
and lots of our players would rather drive around in a badger than work as a team in a vehicle.

A big part of me misses the early stages of UT where there weren't many vehicles, and you actually had to share/stack up a vehicle to get places. It was awesome teamwork, especially one vehicle which I haven't been able to find again... It was like the troop carrier, had maybe one weapon, held lots of players, and the rear door would open up so you could see everyone sitting inside; Now UT feels really individualistic, and the little teamwork that happens gives you a massive advantage.

Also the link raptor sounds awesome. If it's only 250 health and short range, I think it's speed should be similar to the Falcon / Wasp.

Tater wrote: ↑Wed Aug 25, 2021 1:17 pm A big part of me misses the early stages of UT where there weren't many vehicles, and you actually had to share/stack up a vehicle to get places. It was awesome teamwork, especially one vehicle which I haven't been able to find again... It was like the troop carrier, had maybe one weapon, held lots of players, and the rear door would open up so you could see everyone sitting inside; Now UT feels really individualistic, and the little teamwork that happens gives you a massive advantage.

Also the link raptor sounds awesome. If it's only 250 health and short range, I think it's speed should be similar to the Falcon / Wasp.

Oh, the good 'ol days... unfortunately, these days if we could even get people to play maps like that, they'd all just drive off and leave your ass to run on foot.

Pooty, I see your point on the wraith, but I would love to see that link weapon as a primary or secondary fire on a flyer of some sort. I agree with Tater, it would need a little speed boost like the flacon to ever be able catch up to another flyer and get close enough to drain it.

Tater wrote: ↑Wed Aug 25, 2021 1:17 pm

pooty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 25, 2021 10:11 am
and lots of our players would rather drive around in a badger than work as a team in a vehicle.

A big part of me misses the early stages of UT where there weren't many vehicles, and you actually had to share/stack up a vehicle to get places. It was awesome teamwork, especially one vehicle which I haven't been able to find again... It was like the troop carrier, had maybe one weapon, held lots of players, and the rear door would open up so you could see everyone sitting inside; Now UT feels really individualistic, and the little teamwork that happens gives you a massive advantage.

Also the link raptor sounds awesome. If it's only 250 health and short range, I think it's speed should be similar to the Falcon / Wasp.

Yeah man on the Torlan servers we’d get 5 passengers on a Manta to get a good start… and massively berated if you didn’t let everyone hop on! People would even ride on top of a full hellbender to taxi to the center mode. Pepperidge farm remembers

YEAAAHHHHHHHHHH wrote: ↑Wed Aug 25, 2021 5:59 pm ...
Yeah man on the Torlan servers we’d get 5 passengers on a Manta to get a good start… and massively berated if you didn’t let everyone hop on! People would even ride on top of a full hellbender to taxi to the center mode. Pepperidge farm remembers

GTKY said you can get 5 people on a hover board at once. I've never seen more than 2 even attempt it with any of our current crew.

I only can dream of a team that understands the importance of using hover boards at the beginning of Mega-Arena and building their nodes all the way to completion.

McLovin wrote: ↑Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:13 am I only can dream of a team that understands the importance of using hover boards at the beginning of Mega-Arena and building their nodes all the way to completion.

lol we had a 3v3 match on there... and we dominated.. Tater and I used nothing BUT hoverboards...lol.

All you need for that map are hoverboards, grenades, and communication. Although you can work it that way solo too.